I have an interesting story to relate to all. I was a volunteer at Pints to Pasta on Sunday and with me were two (2) Nike Team in Training Walkers. I got into a discussion with one of the gals regarding training programs, walks, etc. She told me that she used a Camel Back system and her coach actually asked her if she was going to carry that during the marathon. The coach indicated that she didn't need to carry all that water because there were aid stations every two miles. The gal insisted [to her coach] that she was going to use her Camel Back because it was something she was used to carrying on hikes, walks, backpacking trips, etc.

I was stunned that a coach would actually say this to someone they were responsible for training. All I could tell her was that not a single Portland Fit coach or assistant coach would ever discourage us from whatever hydration system we chose to use, as long as we chose something.

Is anyone as surprised as I am? I am certainly glad I am training with Portland Fit; we do have the best coaches.

Kathi

Runners faster than 3:30 can often get away without carrying hydration systems since they rarely go more than 15-20 minutes without a water station. You can get caught up in technical arguments over the tradeoff between carrying a drink versus drinking only at water stations, but I'd draw the line at 3:30. That being said, I couldn't imagine telling a walker to go without some means of carrying a drink.

Just to clarify, Team in Training is a program of the Leukemia & Lymphoma Society. Nike is one of their national sponsors. Team in Training has been a very successful program so I couldn't make any judgment on their methods, but it's nice to know that we coaches are held in such high regard.

Eric,

Thank you for clarifying that for me; I honestly didn't know.

Kathi

Kathi -

Yes, I think we all agree that folks should carry whatever hydration system(s) work for them, as long as they are comfortable with it. It would have been better for that coach to ask if she had ever considered other systems and was satisfied with what she had.

I agree with coach Eric about the pace and the frequency of water/aid stations determining when some runners do ok without carrying hydration. If the weather isn't too warm, and if aid stations are every 2 miles (likely for PDX), then at 8 min/mile (3:30 pace) a runner hits an aid station every 16 minutes. That's about when out hydration seminar suggested we should have about 8 oz of water/drink (every quarter hour.) Some people might be able to go 18 or 20 minutes (3:58 or 4:22 goal time) between those aid stations. Some might not. But out 21 miler probably was a pretty good indication of what the weather might be for Oct 1, so each of us should have a pretty good idea of our hydration needs.

As coach JR said in the "Wall" seminar, he likes to carry a water bottle just so he can control when he wants to drink, etc. It can be filled up at the aid stations.

My own experience corresponds to what coach Eric said. All those 3:30 or better marathons I never carried any hydration (in those days few people did.) That worked out ok.

But one where I went out too fast and the weather was warmer... not good... hit the wall and was on the ground with painful leg cramps. No fun. Finished, though. Good hydration would've helped some...

It would have been good to have hydration along on Pike's Peak. They had a few water stations, but not many (ok, it was 27 years ago) and the temperature at the finish was above 85 F in the shade. That plus going from 6400 ft to 14100 ft in the 1st half, and the fact that they essentially ran out of water at the last station 5 or so miles from the finish... I'm glad it was downhill from there to the line. I had ro *really* re-hydrate at the finish. My strong advice: please don't anyone even think about doing something like this w/o a hydration plan and system. You want to be able to control your own destiny. Heck, you want to *have* a destiny- something besides the hospital or a body bag.

We are very lucky in PDXFit to have that 21 miler as an excellent preview of Oct 1. The course, the weather, our hydration/electrolytes, the great coaching and all the folks involved...

Take care, stay safe, and just do relaxed and enjoyable training until October..

Gene

Yeah, that last post ("guest") was really me ("gene..."), FWIW.

Gene

Have you tasted the water/sports drinks at the aid stations?

MMMM What flavor is this? Warm Index Finger Punch? Garden Hose?
My personal opinion is that bonking is better than Ultima Tastes. (as long as I still PR when bonking). Since I can't count on PR & Bonks I get high on my own supply. Team Tony in full effect on the course.

I'd like a bandoleer of waters but that does get heavy.

Do any BLUE runners work at CULLIGAN? I'd like them to pull the office water cooler on a dolly next to me throughout PDX course. I'll need a wingman also to enforce EMPLOYEES ONLY rule.

That's would be a hydration system!
Tony

One morning I was out running and saw a couple gals in running gear bending over a bush near a bed of flowers planted in one of our common areas out by the road.

When I stopped to say hi, I found out what they were doing.

One of them would go to the store and buy some bottled water.
The other one would go out the night before and plant the bottles in strategic places along the running route for the following morning.
As long as the bottles were still sealed properly when they got them in the morning, ok. If a bottle wasn't they wouldn't use it.

They switched off the roles of who buys and who stashes the bottles.

Gene

All this time I've been thinking I'd not be using my hydration system during the marathon because of all the aid stations, but the 21 miler may have changed my opinion. I did an even 8:00 pace for the half marathon; if I could do that at the marathon I'd probably be fine without my bottle. But I did the 21 miler at a miserable 9:37 pace, which puts me at a 4:25 marathon. So much for that idea. Plus, I'm sure I don't get 8oz at the aid stations, with sloshing and such.

Uh... the numeric "tilt alarm" just went off in my head (10 min pace is 4:22 and change.)

9:37 pace would be about a 4:12 marathon, wouldn't it?

If you were age 65, that would be a Boston qualifier... :-)

Gene

Right you are, Gene. Slipped a digit somewhere. Better than slipping a disk, I guess.

Jimbo, you make a really good point here ... it's great to have options in case the marathon doesn't go as planned. The downside of carrying a hydration system is the added weight but for most of us that downside is *outweighed* <snicker> by the benefits. A runner who weighs 150 lbs who carries a 3 lb hydration system is adding 2% to his or her body weight. Assume for a minute that results in a 2% decrease in pace compared to ideal conditions. That would increase a 3:30 marathoner's time by perhaps 4 minutes. Unless a runner is an experienced marathoner or is very focused on achieving a Boston qualifying time, I think a runner should stick with some form of hydration system. Carrying a 20 oz bottle in all likelihood will have very little effect on your time, especially compared to the possible negative consequences of dehydration.

Jimbo, the one other thing I'd say is that typical Portland Marathon weather is cooler and cloudier than what we experienced Saturday so that will probably work in your favor.

Good point Eric. As a first time marathoner, I would be happy just coming across the finish line, because ultimately that is MY achievement. Maybe on the 2nd one I do, I MIGHT be more concerned about my time. But as a walker and one who will be on the course for at least 6 hours, a hydration plan is my priority. The thought of a lot of water sloshing around in my stomach after hitting every aid station is a bit sickening. My plan for the 21 miler worked just perfect and I felt that if last Saturday was marathon day, I could have done it easily. Now I just can't wait till October 1. Woo Hoo!

Kathi

I agree Kathi. This is also my first marathon and crossing the finish line will be my achievement. I decided to quit worring about my time and make finishing my goal. And heck, I'd be estatic with a miserable 9:37 pace as I'm sure a lot of people would. So quit being so hard on yourself Jimbo. You're doing great.

And Kathi, I'd love to meet you sometime. You've been an great inspiration to a first time marathon walker.

Aunty Jen,

I am at PFit every Saturday and I always love meeting new people. I have met some wonderful people and they have become my dearest friends. As far as being an inspiration, I am greatly surprised. Most of the time I am on this discussion forum asking questions because I don't know what to expect. I went from a total couch potato to a marathon walker in 6 months, and that's a big WOW for me. Now I just can't get enough and am really going to miss the whole PFit experience this winter.

Look for me this Saturday; I'm going to wear my blue Adidas shirt and black shorts (with the blue stripes down the sides). Hope to see you then.

Kathi

Hey Kathi,

You can join some of the StayFit runners and walkers over the winter. I'll be out with the Portland folks on Saturdays. I believe there will also be a group in Vancouver as well. Check out this thread: http://www.portlandfit.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=756

If you want to stay in shape over the winter and be really prepared for PFit next March, this is the group to join. You will come into next year's season with a different focus: improving pace and beating the PR you set this year!

You've come a long way and you ARE an inspiration!!

Sharon

Sharon,

Believe me I was thinking about the StayFit program and read the thread on it, but wondered if any walkers would be out and about. I should post and see what I come up with. Thanks for your kind words and encouragement, Sharon.

Kathi

I'm looking forward to walking this winter with the Stayfit group. I'm looking forward to just finishing the marathon this year, but can't wait until next year when I can work on my speed and not just endurance.

Kathi, I'll have to wait until race day to meet you. I've been advised to stay off my foot as much as possible until then (bad case of plantar faciitis).

Jen,

I am so sorry to hear about your foot problems...Yikes how painful. I too am excited about signing up again next year. Good luck with your foot and hopefully we will meet up on Marathon day. (That would be a huge, gigantic and happy smile from me). Race Day - Can't wait.

Kathi